You have connected (8:10:19 AM)
8:10:34 AM Dedalvs: Hey everyone! We're back and streaming again.
Fenhl [~Fenhl@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (8:14:56 AM)
8:24:43 AM Rakko: cool
8:25:51 AM Dedalvs: Hey, Rakko. :)
8:26:01 AM Dedalvs: If I remember, you said you're from the middle of the US?
pne [5c43b199@ircip1.mibbit.com] entered the room. (8:32:00 AM)
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8:33:17 AM Rakko: yeah
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8:34:20 AM pne: am I in?
8:34:58 AM Fenhl: yup
8:35:28 AM Rakko: hi!
8:36:25 AM pne: wo?
8:36:30 AM pne: (bad German pun)
8:36:39 AM Rakko: hier
8:38:37 AM irina: eek! /me swims away very very fast
8:41:55 AM Dedalvs: Hi, Irina!
8:41:59 AM Dedalvs: It's me, David!
8:44:11 AM irina: yes, I recognise your nick :-)
8:45:52 AM irina: that's a very very bad painting of Queen Beatrix, if I was her and I saw it I'd order it taken down.
8:46:09 AM Dedalvs: Oh, right, yeah. And yes, I completely agree!
8:46:21 AM Dedalvs: I heard that was the queen, and I thought, "Wow! They must not like her here!"
8:46:45 AM irina: it's been annoying me all the time when I was watching the panel livestream yesterday
8:46:57 AM Dedalvs: Yeah. Nothing we can do about it, unfortunately. :(
8:47:12 AM irina: hang a cloth over it?
8:47:23 AM Dedalvs: LOL I would never presume!
8:47:31 AM Dedalvs: brb
8:48:39 AM Fenhl: irina: you passed your Ring B torch to Andrej Šuc, right?
8:48:57 AM irina: yup
8:49:18 AM irina: I saw it go on a few steps too
8:53:14 AM Fenhl: I just asked because the wiki page still said "before apr 17 or after apr 24"
8:53:18 AM Fenhl: or something
8:53:35 AM Fenhl: I currently have the torch
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8:55:42 AM irina: that week was insanely busy but I got it on the 27th or so, let me check
8:56:03 AM irina: (the 17-24 week I mean)
8:57:05 AM irina: yes, got it 27, sent to Andren 29.
8:57:11 AM Fenhl: ok
8:57:13 AM irina: Andrej*
9:04:19 AM Fenhl: irina: he's making photos of you
9:04:32 AM Fenhl: and everyone else in here
guitarplayer [~guitar@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (9:07:23 AM)
9:07:27 AM guitarplayer: hi
9:10:35 AM Dedalvs: Hey everyone. For those following along just online, we're not going to be able to release this link publicly (I think it'll probably be public by default, but we'll have to make it private), because Brenda Hilbig is still going to be taking this film around to festivals, etc.
9:10:53 AM Dedalvs: So you'll have to stay tuned in case she released it on DVD some time in the future.
9:13:07 AM Dedalvs: I love this. Who feeds their dog food they  make on the stove?!
9:14:49 AM irina: Fenhl: I don't know who you mean by 'he' but whoever it it should't have made a photo of me, I was in the shower! :-)
9:15:08 AM Fenhl: lol, nvm then
9:15:30 AM irina: now I'm curious!
9:15:44 AM Dedalvs: Wait… Where do we go to view pictures of Irina in the shower...?
9:15:52 AM Dedalvs: ;)
9:16:14 AM irina: I don't think anyone will be interested in my saggy middle-aged sopping-wet body!
9:16:20 AM Dedalvs: lol
9:16:37 AM Dedalvs: Hey, how is the quality for this video watching on the stream?
9:17:30 AM irina: my sound quality is such that I just turned it off, I have to use headphones to understand anything at all
9:17:37 AM Dedalvs: Ah...
9:17:42 AM irina: but picture quality is adequate, I could see what was going on
9:17:50 AM Dedalvs: Okay.
9:18:29 AM irina: probably a problem on my side, sound quality of this laptop isn't very good (but I hardly ever use sound so that doesn't matter)
9:18:46 AM Dedalvs: Ah. I got you.
9:19:46 AM pne: The front door and the kitchen belong to two different houses of mutual friends of mine and the cameraman's
9:19:57 AM Dedalvs: Really!
9:19:59 AM pne: The living room is in the same house as the kitchen
9:20:09 AM Dedalvs: Wait, are the front door and kitchen are from different houses!?
9:20:09 AM pne: Later, we'll see a hallway; that belongs to the front door
9:20:15 AM pne: Dedalvs: exactly
9:20:18 AM Dedalvs: lol
9:20:24 AM Dedalvs: Front door wasn't pretty enough?
9:20:37 AM Dedalvs: Here's another human feeding a dog from the stove!
9:20:39 AM pne: No idea :)
9:20:43 AM pne: yup!
9:20:50 AM Dedalvs: Who are these people?! Is this common in Germany?
9:21:06 AM pne: I've no idea! I don't have a dog. Dog food in tins is certainly common enough....
9:21:18 AM Dedalvs: lol Love this part.
9:21:43 AM pne: Poor guy!
9:21:52 AM pne: You can see the family name at the top of the hallway :)
9:21:52 AM Dedalvs: She doesn't know dogs very well, evidently.
9:21:56 AM pne: in black letters
9:22:05 AM Dedalvs: I also spotted an Oscar, by the way.
9:22:10 AM Dedalvs: In the first woman's house.
9:22:11 AM pne: was there!
9:22:24 AM Dedalvs: Nice plant. ;)
9:22:59 AM pne: Now we're coming to a real vet's office she let them use one Saturday
9:23:15 AM Dedalvs: (Sidenote: The whole snake + staff thing for doctors totally seems like something someone would invent for a conlang.)
9:23:26 AM pne: They rearranged the chairs in the waiting room for the film, and the vet said at the private screening that she rather liked the new arrangement :)
9:23:33 AM Dedalvs: lol
9:24:04 AM pne: One of the girls sitting there is the cameraman's daughter :)
9:24:18 AM pne: She's really a vet
9:24:19 AM pne: IRL
9:24:25 AM Dedalvs: The cameraman's daughter?!
9:24:28 AM Dedalvs: Or the woman talking?
9:24:36 AM pne: The woman who stood in the doorway
9:24:44 AM pne: who played the vet in the film
9:24:48 AM Dedalvs: Ahh...
9:24:52 AM Dedalvs: Was she the vet that worked there?
9:25:02 AM pne: Yes, exactly
9:25:16 AM pne: lol @ leo
9:25:23 AM Dedalvs: lol
9:25:40 AM Dedalvs: Hey, she shouldn't be mad: The woman found her dog for her!
9:25:43 AM Dedalvs: Could've gone otherwise.
9:25:56 AM pne: sure, but you know how emotions go! not always rational
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Thavernes [~Thavernes@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (9:30:03 AM)
9:31:29 AM guitarplayer: at least this time we don't have a problem with the sun shining in too much, so that people watching the stream can't see anything
9:31:38 AM guitarplayer: (we have blinds, but outside it rains :\)=
9:31:41 AM guitarplayer: =*
9:31:56 AM Dedalvs: Yeah, that is nice.
9:32:04 AM Dedalvs: Plus we go to see some hale. :)
9:32:25 AM cedh: dedalvs: I just sent you the slides
9:32:41 AM Thavernes: * is Sven Huynink *
9:32:42 AM Dedalvs: Which e-mail address?
9:32:47 AM cedh: gmail
9:32:48 AM Dedalvs: Hey, Sven!
kaleissin [~taliesin@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (9:32:55 AM)
9:33:26 AM Dedalvs: Got them.
9:33:37 AM cedh: great
9:37:26 AM Dedalvs: There's recently been a long discussion on Conlang about Fith. And Rosta has claimed that there's nothing particularly complex or non-human about Fith.
9:39:16 AM Dedalvs: Incidentally: Ithkuil's website http://ithkuil.net/
9:39:33 AM kaleissin: depends on how deep a stack you get
9:39:36 AM Thavernes: It's wonderfully logical & simplke (at first sight, that is)
9:39:39 AM Dedalvs: And Fith's website: http://www.langmaker.com/fith.htm
Rejis [~tux@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (9:39:48 AM)
9:39:55 AM Dedalvs: Some of the things that make Fith so odd is the whole stack-switching thing.
9:40:36 AM pne: kaleissin: I think that was his point - that you can also do things in natlangs that need more short-term memory than people have
9:40:39 AM Rejis: yeah... the Forth-ishness
9:40:43 AM Dedalvs: http://www.langmaker.com/stackconj.htm
9:40:51 AM pne: Arguably, that sort of thing is more common stylistically in Fith
9:41:34 AM kaleissin: has been quite a bit of research on max. recursion
9:42:31 AM kaleissin: funnily enough, there was a lot more recursion 8in written text) in the time of Dickens
9:42:51 AM kaleissin: speech rarely go deeper than three
9:43:04 AM pne: except for tail recursion?
9:43:07 AM irina: is that the "house that Jack built" thing?
9:43:11 AM kaleissin: yep
9:43:12 AM Dedalvs: Or the American national anthem.
9:43:17 AM pne: I saw the man who wore the hat that I bought at the house that was painted red by the man who ...
9:43:42 AM pne: which is not a problem until someone tries to add stuff to the end that refers to a higher level on the stack :)
9:45:01 AM guitarplayer: fun fact: "gern" was a verb once, it's survived as "begehren" (to long for). i've seen it used as an adverb already in middle high german texts, though.
9:45:36 AM Dedalvs: For Americans, that's one of the really alien-feeling structures one has to learn when learning German.
9:46:35 AM Dedalvs: Wow, that's interesting: see = read
9:46:42 AM guitarplayer: tone langs sound fun :)
9:46:57 AM Rejis: pne: it is in rejistanian a big problem...
9:47:55 AM guitarplayer: Dedalvs: German has "lesen" (to read) and "auflesen" (to pick up)
9:48:00 AM guitarplayer: kinda nice as well
9:48:04 AM pne: Dedalvs: another fun Chinese verb: open = drive [a car]
9:48:06 AM Fenhl: Rejis: het, het, het, het, het, het, het, het, het, het
9:48:21 AM Dedalvs: pne: Wow! Never heard that one.
9:48:24 AM pne: guitarplayer: I think the "gather, collect" meaning is the original one
9:48:28 AM Rejis: Fenhl: yeah ;)
9:48:29 AM pne: Similarly with Latin "legere"
9:48:29 AM Dedalvs: guitarplayer: How does "auflesen" work?
9:48:31 AM guitarplayer: pne: yeah
9:48:43 AM Dedalvs: Like, literally to pick something up?
9:48:52 AM guitarplayer: Dedalvs: auf 'up' + lesen 'to gather, collect' => 'to pick up'
9:48:57 AM Dedalvs: Ich lese die Apfel auf?
9:49:07 AM Dedalvs: Ohhh...
9:49:09 AM guitarplayer: if you pick them up from the ground, yeah :)
9:49:16 AM Dedalvs: So "lesen" is originally "to pick up" not "to read"?
9:49:26 AM guitarplayer: seems so, like philip said
9:49:28 AM pne: Dedalvs: I think more like "gather"
9:49:47 AM Dedalvs: Wow. Very cool!
9:50:34 AM Dedalvs: That is also really cool (V + stereotypical object = verb).
9:50:39 AM pne: yup
9:50:55 AM Rejis: indeed
9:51:00 AM pne: Also fun are verb + cognate object, e.g. "He dreamed a dream" instead of just "He dreamed"
9:51:16 AM cedh: reminds me of noun incorporation
9:51:24 AM pne: which is, I suppose, just a more specific form of the Chinese example
9:51:35 AM guitarplayer: http://www.woerterbuchnetz.de/DWB?bookref=12,774,27 <- the Grimm article on 'lesen'
9:51:47 AM guitarplayer: (fwiw)
9:52:23 AM Dedalvs: Thanks!
9:54:20 AM guitarplayer: http://fiziwig.com/conlang/soaloa/soaloa.html anyone?
9:54:32 AM Dedalvs: Hey, so you do remember it!
9:54:46 AM Dedalvs: No one said anything when I asked if anyone remembered that one yesterday.
9:55:01 AM guitarplayer: oh
9:55:03 AM guitarplayer: :)
9:55:12 AM Dedalvs: lol
9:56:27 AM Dedalvs: Christophe says it's like those optical ilusions.
9:56:28 AM pne: We fed the bananas to the monkeys because they were ripe
9:56:29 AM Dedalvs: *illusions
9:56:32 AM pne: We fed the bananas to the monkeys because they were hungry
9:56:44 AM Dedalvs: Mmmm… Ripe monkeys.
9:56:51 AM pne: and hungry bananas, yes
9:56:53 AM irina: Hungry bananas!
9:57:04 AM Dedalvs: Sounds like a band name.
9:57:30 AM pne: "Mung Key and the Hungry Bananas"?
9:57:35 AM Dedalvs: LOL
9:57:37 AM Dedalvs: Love it.
9:57:54 AM guitarplayer: I imagine  they'd be a comedy folk band
9:58:04 AM guitarplayer: or a punk band
AndroUser [~androirc@167-4.nyc.dsl.access.net] entered the room. (9:58:04 AM)
9:58:06 AM irina: or a high school nerd band
9:58:11 AM Dedalvs: lol
9:58:20 AM guitarplayer: irina: in which case they'd probably play mathrock
AndroUser is now known as Amanda (9:58:31 AM)
9:58:40 AM pne: do you know "Finite Simple Group of Order Two"?
9:58:50 AM Dedalvs: With their hit "Will You Be My Cosecant?"
9:59:02 AM irina: my daughter has been invited to sing in one but just as she was about to say yes stuff happened and she changed schools
9:59:06 AM Amanda: hi all
9:59:13 AM irina: hi Amanda!
9:59:27 AM Dedalvs: lol Tartartartartarta...
9:59:30 AM Dedalvs: Hey, Amanda!
9:59:41 AM Amanda: awaxe on East Coast w/baby, dropped by :-) 
9:59:53 AM Amanda: awake
9:59:57 AM pne: welcome!
10:00:03 AM pne: are you following the live stream?
10:00:12 AM pne: http://conference.conlang.org/lcc4/live.php
10:00:22 AM Rejis: *lol*
10:00:22 AM Dedalvs: Reminds me of Turkish causatives.
10:00:35 AM irina: real life calls, see you later
10:00:35 AM Rejis: true, Dedalvs 
10:00:39 AM Amanda: also w/onscreen touch keyboard typos
10:00:41 AM Dedalvs: Bye, Irina. :)
10:01:11 AM pne: self-segregating morphology ftw
10:01:23 AM Amanda: can't follow stream on this tablet, sadly
10:01:36 AM guitarplayer: does anyone remember "Schlupp vom Grünen Stern" (iirc was the title) from Augsburger Puppenkiste?
10:01:41 AM Dedalvs: Would you be able to follow an audio stream, Amanda?
10:01:46 AM pne: guitarplayer: I don't
10:01:50 AM Amanda: will catch up later on ustream
10:01:51 AM guitarplayer: the villain there always said [ɾamʃasarːːː] when he was angry
10:02:11 AM Thavernes: "I like it"is the only good reason to do something
10:02:12 AM Amanda: audio link gives error!
10:02:12 AM Dedalvs: Because if you can follow an audio stream, I'll put one up for you.
10:02:15 AM Dedalvs: I know.
10:02:18 AM Dedalvs: I have to put it up.
10:02:19 AM Rejis: guitarplayer: I do
10:02:29 AM Dedalvs: Want me to do so?
10:02:45 AM guitarplayer: I was just reminded of that from henrik's tartartartartar...
10:02:59 AM guitarplayer: well anyway
10:03:00 AM Rejis: yeah
10:03:04 AM Amanda: Actually audio would be bad from a baby sleep perspective
10:03:08 AM Rejis: me too
10:03:16 AM pne: headphones?
10:03:18 AM Dedalvs: Okay.
10:03:25 AM Dedalvs: Unless you want me to sing lullabyes.
10:03:29 AM pne: initial mutation, yum
10:03:34 AM Amanda: haha:-) 
10:03:54 AM Rejis: neat, indeed
10:04:31 AM pne: like Palastine / Falastin
10:04:33 AM guitarplayer: this kinda reminds me of SIAL
10:04:35 AM pne: *Palestine
10:04:35 AM Dedalvs: Pitru: Being Peter. Sounds like a new "deep" movie.
10:04:49 AM guitarplayer: from which i had to translate twice in relays
10:05:03 AM Amanda: By the time I remembered lcc yesterday you all were done
10:05:21 AM guitarplayer: except in SIAL, word class was marked by a thematic vowel
10:05:35 AM Amanda: today I hope to tune back in for the relay
10:05:54 AM guitarplayer: I won't be there anymore for the relay, alas :(
10:06:14 AM Amanda: sorry to hear it!
10:06:19 AM Fenhl: WHAT HAPPEN?!
10:06:20 AM Dedalvs: Several people will have to leave early, too. So it goes. That's the way with travel. :)
10:06:30 AM guitarplayer: Fenhl: going back home this afternoon
10:06:33 AM Amanda: what's the current talk on?
10:06:36 AM Thavernes: Isn't this getting rid of the OBject?
10:06:58 AM guitarplayer: Dedalvs: the youtube video is free to view for those who have the link now
10:07:16 AM Dedalvs: Don't link it yet!
10:07:23 AM Fenhl: guitarplayer: I know. I was referencing the slide
10:07:23 AM Dedalvs: It must be a surprise! :)
10:07:31 AM Dedalvs: Okie doke.
10:07:31 AM guitarplayer: Fenhl: oh ;)
10:07:36 AM guitarplayer: Dedalvs: of course!
10:08:16 AM guitarplayer: Dedalvs: the video's not listed in my profile, but you can watch it with the direct link
10:08:31 AM Dedalvs: Got  it. I also have it uploaded.
10:08:35 AM guitarplayer: ok
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10:11:08 AM Dedalvs: You know where we do see that k/v alternation? Swahili.
10:11:15 AM Dedalvs: Kitabu "book" / vitabu "books"
10:11:25 AM pne: oh right, there too
10:11:30 AM guitarplayer: that's to do with reanalysis, though, no?
10:11:34 AM guitarplayer: class markers
10:11:42 AM Dedalvs: That particular example.
10:11:43 AM guitarplayer: also vipilefti :)
10:11:48 AM Dedalvs: lol
10:11:50 AM Dedalvs: That's a good one!
10:12:04 AM Dedalvs: But there are a ton of native words that work that way.
10:12:06 AM pne: that's a myth, isn't it?
10:12:15 AM guitarplayer: *shrugs*
10:12:51 AM Dedalvs: kisu/visu "knife" Not a borrowing, is it?
10:13:41 AM Amanda: me and baby back to sleep. Later!
10:13:56 AM Dedalvs: Night!
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10:14:57 AM Fenhl: There's a saying on this list that goes something like, "if [ni] can change into [ɑ], then anything is possible." For example: [ni] > [nji] > [ji] > [ɹi] > [ɹ̩] > [əɹ] > [ɑɹ] > [ɑ] Or something like that; it's completely plausible. —Arthaey
10:15:12 AM pne: I think the quote is from Yuen Ren Chao
10:15:13 AM Dedalvs: lol
10:16:49 AM Dedalvs: Incidentally, there was a fun SpecGram article about a language that evolves to have no wordclasses but adverbs: http://specgram.com/CLII.g/02.gladstone.shigudo.html
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10:20:38 AM Fenhl: questions?
10:24:23 AM Fenhl: video crashed
10:24:55 AM guitarplayer: I think david may just have repaired it?
10:25:00 AM Fenhl: and we're back on air
10:25:06 AM guitarplayer: he did ~something~ at the camera table thing
tzirtzi [~tzirtzi@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (10:26:33 AM)
10:26:36 AM Fenhl: <SF|008> (shit! game-ACC 1PS-NOM lose-PST!)
10:27:38 AM guitarplayer: ?
10:28:35 AM Fenhl: from #conlang @ Freenode
10:30:14 AM guitarplayer: oh, ok
10:31:49 AM Dedalvs: By the way, the handouts are already up for the morning session (or most of them).
10:32:00 AM Dedalvs: This talk is a Prezi, so you can actually follow along on the web.
10:32:14 AM Dedalvs: http://prezi.com/qwokkakcxlcq/introduction-to-surdeclinaison/
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10:33:00 AM guitarplayer: netsplit, wheeeeeeeeee
pne2 is now known as pne (10:33:32 AM)
10:33:54 AM Dedalvs: The hell was that?!
10:34:08 AM Rakko: nice netsplit we had
10:34:28 AM Rakko: one of the joys of IRC
10:34:35 AM Dedalvs: lol
10:34:45 AM guitarplayer: in rooms with many people it's kinda fun to watch
10:34:46 AM Rakko: pne: I'm working on a conlang, the protolang of which has a word /pnee/
10:34:58 AM Rakko: it means "we"
10:35:36 AM guitarplayer: pink on black doesn't work too well (for my colorblind eyes) :(
10:35:53 AM guitarplayer: at least not *that* shade
10:36:01 AM guitarplayer: (too dark, too little contrast)
10:36:02 AM Dedalvs: This actually reminds me of old AOL chat rooms.
10:36:14 AM Dedalvs: Where a rogue poster could change the background and font color for EVERYONE.
10:36:23 AM Dedalvs: E.g. by changing it to purple on black. ;)
10:36:29 AM Rakko: yeeg
10:36:51 AM guitarplayer: Dedalvs: :OOO
10:36:53 AM guitarplayer: ;)
10:37:26 AM Thavernes: Adamo, not Brel
10:37:29 AM guitarplayer: jacques brel song on the declension of "rosa"? lol
10:37:31 AM guitarplayer: oh
10:37:57 AM Thavernes: But a nice song anyway
10:39:08 AM Rejis: '25 numbers'... don't give me ideas...
10:39:39 AM Dedalvs: lol purple on black again. :D
10:39:54 AM guitarplayer: donaudampfschiffahrtsgesellschaftskapitänswitwenrentenbescheidausstellungsbeamtengattinnenkaffeekränzchen oh the fun you can have :P
10:41:22 AM Thavernes: LOL
10:42:12 AM guitarplayer: [ˈzʊfɪk͡s.ˈa͡ofnaːmə]
10:44:52 AM Fenhl: Donaudampfschifffahrtsgesellschaftskapitänsmützenverzierungsrandeinfassungsfabrikchefbürostuhllehnenverkauftsstandpavillonszeltfarbpinselhaarscherenschleifsteinmehrwertsteuererhöhungskonferenzeintrittskartenlesegerätshüllenschraubenzieherkasten
10:45:06 AM Fenhl: that's the version I know
10:45:17 AM Fenhl: it's not complete
Broca [~arj@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (10:46:57 AM)
10:47:08 AM guitarplayer: do you know the Rindfleischverpackungsüberwachungsaufgabenübertragungsgesetz (I think that was its name)?
10:47:45 AM Fenhl: heard of it, yes
10:48:01 AM Broca: guitarplayer: I think that's the abbreviated title
10:48:03 AM pne: ANd that was the "short name" of the law
10:48:07 AM Dedalvs: lol
10:48:12 AM pne: ninja
10:48:20 AM Broca: gmta
10:48:38 AM kaleissin: pirate! Arrh!
10:49:03 AM Fenhl: http://xkcd.com/856/
10:49:33 AM ingsve: good morning
10:49:53 AM Dedalvs: Goedemorgen!
10:50:10 AM pne: God morgon!
10:50:39 AM Broca: Since we're already trading links to webcomics, http://www.foxtrot.com/2011/05/05082011/
10:50:56 AM pne: haha, yeah
10:54:28 AM Dedalvs: There's a slogan. Basque: It's Not Persecuted Anymore in France!
10:54:55 AM pne: lol
10:54:57 AM guitarplayer: hah
10:55:07 AM tzirtzi: which is the best you can say for any language in france except french...
10:55:30 AM kaleissin: Basque rocks! Nuff said
10:55:42 AM Dedalvs: Unless you're the Académie Francçaise, in which case French is constantly under assault by English loandwords.
10:55:53 AM pne: tzirtzi: probably true
10:56:03 AM ingsve: Basque is the bomb
10:56:14 AM Dedalvs: ^
10:58:12 AM pne: fun when people can't agree on number of cases
10:58:32 AM Dedalvs: I've seen that first hand. I can tell you stories about working on Moro...
10:58:59 AM Dedalvs: http://idiom.ucsd.edu/~rose/Moro.html
10:59:01 AM Broca: Moro sounds like fun.
10:59:13 AM Dedalvs: And we had the same discussion about tone.
10:59:20 AM Dedalvs: Which I still contend Moro does NOT have.
10:59:40 AM ingsve: "Moro sounds like fun." at least in Norway ^
11:05:42 AM Rakko: good night
11:05:48 AM Dedalvs: Night. :P)
11:05:49 AM pne: nini
11:05:50 AM Dedalvs: :)
11:05:50 AM Rejis: gn!
11:05:59 AM Fenhl: õ
Rakko left the room (quit: Quit: Leaving). (11:06:31 AM)
11:11:12 AM Dedalvs: That's "He's told me that [he here-to]." ?
11:11:47 AM Dedalvs: I can't even follow that.
11:11:55 AM Dedalvs: That is tease the meaning out of it.
11:11:59 AM pne: I think the allative replaces the "that"
11:12:09 AM pne: He told me to-[he is here]
11:12:11 AM pne: ?
11:12:20 AM Dedalvs: Ahhh...
11:13:06 AM Dedalvs: Poor donkeys. They always get such a bad rap.
11:13:30 AM pne: somewhere donkey-ADJ should mean "hard-working"?
11:13:34 AM Broca: Tell that to the Democratic Party!
11:13:36 AM Dedalvs: Yes!
11:13:39 AM Dedalvs: Justice for donkeys!
11:14:08 AM Broca: Are donkeys stereotypically stubborn in English?
11:14:19 AM Dedalvs: They are.
11:14:29 AM Dedalvs: There is no word for "donkey" in Dothraki.
11:14:38 AM Dedalvs: But when I create one, donkey+ven will mean "hard working".
11:14:53 AM ingsve: you don't play poker do you david?
11:15:13 AM Dedalvs: Only recreationally. :)
11:15:25 AM pne: mind-blowing!
11:15:29 AM Broca: The Dothraki (is that the demonym?) would probably think of donkeys as a poor excuse for a horse
11:15:55 AM ingsve: a donkey is a word for a terrible poker player
11:16:01 AM Thavernes: They should be beaten by the Donkeythraki
11:16:06 AM Dedalvs: Ahh...
11:16:18 AM Dedalvs: Donkeys aren't for riding, though, so they wouldn't consider them for that.
11:16:25 AM Dedalvs: lol Donkeythraki.
11:16:35 AM Dedalvs: Sounds like a praody of Don Quixote.
11:16:41 AM Dedalvs: Don Keythraki.
11:16:42 AM kaleissin: curseword indohtraki? :)
11:17:08 AM Dedalvs: There are several. But donkey will not be one of them!
11:17:45 AM ingsve: I guess seawater would be a curse word
11:19:36 AM Dedalvs: No phonemic stress is something I wanted to do recently.
11:19:39 AM pne: superfixing is worse though
11:19:59 AM kaleissin: Dedalvs, predictive stress then?
11:19:59 AM Broca: pne: circumfixing?
11:20:01 AM Dedalvs: Actually did that with the little sketch I did for Asshaii.
11:20:01 AM guitarplayer: what does that look like? i only know prefix, suffix, circumfix
11:20:12 AM guitarplayer: oh, and infix of course
11:20:16 AM Dedalvs: No, not predictive: Phrasal intonation only.
11:20:19 AM Fenhl: my nick has no phonemic stress
11:20:29 AM pne: either add a tonal contour, or adding multiple infixes, is how I imagine it
11:20:44 AM Fenhl: in standard Batu
11:21:06 AM Thavernes: fluid-A
11:21:08 AM Fenhl: in the dialect that is spoken in Fenhl, it's stressed on the first syllable
11:21:22 AM guitarplayer: pne: like in some african languages, where afaik tone can mark tense
11:21:35 AM Broca: kaleissin: I think Akan uses tone in the morphology. Do you remember?
11:21:36 AM Dedalvs: Is "Fenhl" more than one syllable?
11:21:41 AM kaleissin: yes
11:21:57 AM Fenhl: fɛn.xl̩
11:21:58 AM kaleissin: complete with... ah what's the word
11:22:01 AM Rejis: yeah... the h is a verb
11:22:06 AM Broca: kaleissin: downstep?
11:22:06 AM Dedalvs: Ah...
11:22:07 AM Rejis: a vowel
11:22:09 AM Rejis: ah
11:22:13 AM kaleissin: yes! thx
11:22:16 AM Rejis: Rejis... coffee!!!
11:22:24 AM Fenhl: Rejis: in this case not
11:22:45 AM Dedalvs: Note: Christophe's dog's name is Buddy. :)
11:23:04 AM Rejis: oh... yes... got confused because I call you venril /wen"xil/
11:23:45 AM Rejis: (rejistanification of Fenhl)
11:24:34 AM Broca: Next LCC, everyone has to use interlinears in all the examples
11:24:40 AM Broca: I forget the morphemes
11:24:44 AM Fenhl: yeah
11:24:52 AM Dedalvs: Slides get crowded. :(
11:27:46 AM guitarplayer: I tried to include interlinears in all examples, but that was too inconvenient
11:28:30 AM Fenhl: that's a good system
11:28:36 AM Broca: Dedalvs: well, Christophe has made an entire presentation with just one slide ...
11:28:39 AM Dedalvs: In a perfect world, everyone in the audience would have a laptop and the slides would move along with the presenter, but users could, e.g., click on sentences to get more information (like interlinears).
11:28:52 AM Dedalvs: @Broca: lol!
11:29:11 AM pne: you'd need people with more concentration, or they'd lose track of what the speaker is saying while they're busy looking up more information
11:29:20 AM pne: I doubt most people multi-task sufficiently efficiently
11:29:47 AM Dedalvs: So there should be a series of tests to prove that you're good enough to be in the *audience*, eh? ;p
11:29:54 AM pne: elitist!
11:29:59 AM Dedalvs: lol
11:30:02 AM pne: let's raise the bar for conlanging even more
11:30:12 AM pne: 1) must know IPA
11:30:15 AM pne: 2) ... ?
11:30:20 AM pne: 3) profit!
11:30:22 AM Dedalvs: lol
11:30:31 AM Dedalvs: Real #1: Must love language.
11:30:36 AM pne: true
11:30:36 AM Broca: Must be left-handed and Lithuanian
11:31:15 AM pne: what about women? how do they get beards?
11:31:16 AM Thavernes: must have passed tests for Chinese, Finnish & Basque
11:31:52 AM Thavernes: (I sure hope that the tests will still be a long way in the future or I'm out)
11:31:57 AM Dedalvs: Female conlangers do have beards; they're just deleted before spellout.
11:32:10 AM pne: they don't appear on the surface realisation, you mean?
11:32:14 AM Dedalvs: Yep.
11:32:16 AM pne: but they are on the deep structure?
11:32:17 AM Rejis: pne: well, I do have to shave my face sometimes...
11:32:21 AM Dedalvs: Exactly.
11:32:22 AM Thavernes: all my jokes have beards... does that count?
11:32:25 AM pne: oic
11:32:27 AM Dedalvs: LOL
11:32:31 AM Rejis: lol, Thavernes 
11:32:32 AM guitarplayer: Thavernes: o u
11:33:06 AM Rejis: Î just realized something...
11:33:15 AM Thavernes: o u?
11:33:18 AM Rejis: Rejistanian can do that as well...
11:33:35 AM Rejis: kinda at least....
11:34:36 AM Dedalvs: cedh + tzirtzi: You guys ready to go?
11:34:47 AM cedh: yes
11:34:47 AM tzirtzi: yep
11:35:01 AM Dedalvs: Cool. We're a *little* over time now.
sylviasotomayor [~sylvia@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (11:35:09 AM)
11:35:19 AM Rejis: hi sylviasotomayor 
11:35:28 AM sylviasotomayor: hi
11:35:30 AM Rejis: I didn't see you around ;)
11:35:32 AM Thavernes: S?rtemporaison
11:35:47 AM sylviasotomayor: I'm not usually on irc, but I thought I'd check it out.
11:36:27 AM Rejis: IMHO it is a good way to communicate
11:36:40 AM Fenhl: questions?
11:39:18 AM pne: I think Christophe did an excellent job of knowing his slides - he didn't have to look at the screen to know where he was or what he was going to say next (more than once or twice)
11:39:41 AM pne: as if he had practised the talk a few times so he knew the order well
11:39:55 AM Fenhl: it's probably easier to remember your slides if you have a two-dimensional layout of them
11:41:09 AM Thavernes: I wonder how anyone (Chomsky...) can still pretend that all languages answer to relatively simple 'deep' structures, after such a speech
11:42:20 AM Thavernes: I just *love* that map (but then I'm a geographer by heart)
11:46:01 AM guitarplayer: irc: multiplayer notepad~
11:46:13 AM Fenhl: not really
11:46:17 AM Dedalvs: Akana Wiki: http://www.frathwiki.com/Akana
11:46:18 AM pne: subethaedit, more like
11:46:20 AM guitarplayer: well, the analogy is limited
11:46:21 AM Dedalvs: Wait...
11:46:22 AM Fenhl: PiratePad: multiplayer notepad
11:46:28 AM Dedalvs: No, that's Akana on FrathWiki.
11:46:29 AM Dedalvs: One minute.
11:46:30 AM Fenhl: or Google Wave
11:46:50 AM Dedalvs: http://tzirtzi.ipage.com/akana/index.php?title=Main_Page
Thavernes left the room (quit: Ping timeout: 480 seconds). (11:50:23 AM)
11:52:03 AM Rejis: Fenhl: guitarplayer is referring a bash.org quote
11:52:16 AM sylviasotomayor: I think that happens to most relays - the later turns take longer.
11:52:18 AM guitarplayer: tbh, idk where I picked that one up
11:53:17 AM pne: sylviasotomayor: I wonder why?
11:53:33 AM sylviasotomayor: pne: Me, too, but it seems to be true.
11:53:49 AM pne: huh. never noticed that particularly, but I'll take your word for it.
11:54:09 AM Broca: Don't the translations get more hackneyed as time goes on? Therefore more difficult to work with.
11:54:12 AM sylviasotomayor: pne: it might be a recency bias - it seems to have been true of recent relays.
ThavernesX [~Thavernes@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (11:54:19 AM)
11:54:25 AM sylviasotomayor: broca: that might be it, too
11:54:28 AM ThavernesX: back
11:54:54 AM pne: I was wondering whether it might be that someone gets a bit late and later people figure, well, it's late anyway, who cares if it's just a bit later?
11:54:55 AM sylviasotomayor: also, people's schedules change over time, and the further out your turn is, the harder it is to predict how busy you will actually be.
11:55:04 AM pne: also true
11:55:12 AM sylviasotomayor: kind of like weather prediction
11:55:54 AM pne: reconstructing a language that was never intended to exist is fun! and cool
11:56:08 AM sylviasotomayor: yes, it is!
11:56:49 AM sylviasotomayor: open source conlanging?
11:56:56 AM pne: looks a bit like it!
11:57:10 AM pne: I wonder how many conlangers apply open-source licences to their work
11:57:16 AM guitarplayer: and I've just said it to njenfalgar: it's kinda fun that at some point you can apply linguistic methodology to examine conlangs ;)
11:57:22 AM pne: I know some people have CC-by-[something] on their pages
11:57:34 AM Fenhl: Naeso has been released to the public domain
11:58:39 AM Broca: pne: the Lojban lexicon is public-domain, and the next version of CLL is probably going to be some kind of open documentation licence.
12:00:44 PM sylviasotomayor: stealth collaboration!
12:01:02 PM pne: hee
12:01:23 PM sylviasotomayor: that is probably key - the lack of necessary commitment
12:01:33 PM sylviasotomayor: or required commitment
12:01:34 PM Dedalvs: Marriage proposals work that way too. "Hey, can you help me carry these groceries in? And now that you're here, why not stay for a few decades?"
12:01:35 PM pne: "Collaboration? In my relay?" -- it's more likely than you think!   </meme reference>
12:01:37 PM sylviasotomayor: something like that.
12:02:47 PM sylviasotomayor: that seems a good strategy, too - give people choices over what to do and different ways to do things
12:02:49 PM ThavernesX: Let I make myself clear at the beginning: these remain MY groceries!
12:02:58 PM pne: also interesting that some people can work on cultures, others on geography, others on language, depending on their preferences
12:03:00 PM Dedalvs: LOL
12:03:03 PM pne: sylviasotomayor: what you said
12:03:42 PM ThavernesX: that is a very nice part: doing your own stuff in a common context
12:03:54 PM sylviasotomayor: pne: yes, what you said too - people have different strengths and even then they want to do different things at different times.
12:05:09 PM sylviasotomayor: ThavernesX: Yes, it is difficult to make the whole language family and other families to borrow from, but in a shared context, we can all borrow from each other.
12:05:38 PM ThavernesX: making weird languages is nice, but in the end you always want expressivity, or not?
12:07:11 PM sylviasotomayor: I like the first lesson!
12:08:05 PM pne: a *good* dictator (with a good vision) can be a good thing
12:08:31 PM pne: I just had to think of the Joel Test: (a) is smart and (b) gets things done
12:08:32 PM Fenhl: that first thing is something to consider for Naeso
12:08:37 PM Broca: With a good vision and a succession plan.
12:08:46 PM ThavernesX: a common speech always works (same minimal level of linguistic understanding)
12:08:54 PM sylviasotomayor: Broca: yes!
12:08:57 PM pne: also true, otherwise things fall apart when the dictator leaves or scales down their effort
12:09:15 PM pne: questions?
12:10:20 PM sylviasotomayor: 10-12 people actively involved is a good!
12:10:28 PM sylviasotomayor: That's a lot.
12:11:16 PM pne: sylviasotomayor: it is, and it is!
12:14:10 PM pne: the question is, can you derive *regular* sound shifts?
12:14:20 PM pne: rather than merely similar-looking
cedh left the room (quit: Remote host closed the connection). (12:14:46 PM)
12:14:46 PM Broca: Are regular sound shifts in real linguistics really that stringent?
12:24:28 PM pne: Broca: http://www.tau.ac.il/~naamafr/docs/fg1997.pdf # Tense and Agreement in Agrammatic Production: Pruning the Syntactic Tree
12:25:12 PM Broca: pne: tnx
12:34:46 PM Dedalvs: By the way, Roman's slides are up on the speakers page.
12:34:56 PM pne: Dedalvs: thx
12:38:06 PM sylviasotomayor: I wonder if that -t on the middle value could mean optimal - optimally sized, optimally fast
12:38:20 PM Dedalvs: The most unique. ;)
12:38:33 PM pne: heh
12:38:43 PM pne: "not very ideal"
12:38:51 PM sylviasotomayor: kind of like the idea of best practices - or like Goldilocks would want
12:39:12 PM Fenhl: sylviasotomayor: that's what I'd make of it: "just the right size"
12:39:17 PM pne: have you heard of "Goldilocks plane"? Interesting term :)
12:39:24 PM pne: oops, "Goldilocks planet"
12:39:38 PM sylviasotomayor: ah, like Earth which is just right for us
12:39:44 PM pne: exactly!
12:39:51 PM pne: but applying mostly to extrasolar planets
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12:40:02 PM pne: which are not too hot nor too cold, etc
kaleissin left the room (quit: Ping timeout: 480 seconds). (12:40:07 PM)
12:40:15 PM sylviasotomayor: or like Pratchett's Chair of Specific Anthropomorphics - the world exists to accomodate the chair of the department?
12:40:18 PM Broca: A Goldilocks plane must be a Goldilocks zone for two attributes
12:40:39 PM pne: Broca: are planes still planes if they are bounded?
12:40:51 PM pne: line : line segment :: plane : ?
12:41:02 PM Dedalvs: piece of paper
12:41:06 PM Broca: I dunno, I have almost no maths
12:42:03 PM ThavernesX: LOL
12:42:35 PM pne: discrimination against left-handed people!
12:42:39 PM pne: left = sinister = negative
12:43:23 PM Dedalvs: Like left = conlanger = Lithuanian
12:43:30 PM Fenhl: it's in most Indo-European languages
12:43:45 PM Broca: Left is where the heart is.
12:43:55 PM Dedalvs: Sylvia and I and Andrew Gerber had a long discussion about just this a week or so ago.
12:43:56 PM Fenhl: that left is wrong and right is, well, right
12:44:40 PM ThavernesX: Yes, often sthing is left behind, never 'right behind'. That's discriminating
12:44:56 PM pne: hurr hurr hurr
12:45:02 PM sylviasotomayor: :-)
12:45:17 PM Dedalvs: lol
12:45:27 PM Dedalvs: If it's right behind, it means it's left next to you.
12:45:34 PM Dedalvs: Oh, pardon me: Right next to you.
12:45:44 PM ThavernesX: indeed ;-)
12:45:46 PM Dedalvs: I have trouble telling my left from my right.
12:46:18 PM ThavernesX: conlang-n?jo I am
12:46:27 PM Dedalvs: Heh, heh.
12:47:00 PM ThavernesX: it's quite a difference from yesterday, when I was a conlang-n?no
12:47:09 PM Broca: Dedalvs: it's not fully automatic for me either.
12:47:11 PM Dedalvs: lol
12:47:27 PM Fenhl: ThavernesX: you should set your encoding to UTF-8
12:47:54 PM Dedalvs: What if instead of "right" and "left" we just went way overboard and called them our "good" an "evil" hands?
12:47:59 PM pne: ooh
12:48:10 PM Broca: Level description for beginners/tap at Herräng dance camp: “You need to know your right foot from your left foot, and know on which one you are standing.” So I'm not taking that class this year at least.
12:48:11 PM pne: In Esperanto, "mano" and "malmano"?
12:48:16 PM sylviasotomayor: I would still get them mixed up
12:49:11 PM pne: lol @ the final example!
12:49:12 PM Fenhl: questions?
12:49:18 PM guitarplayer: in my grandparents' generation left-handed children would still be forced to learn being right-handed because left = bad
12:49:34 PM Fenhl: yeah
12:49:55 PM Fenhl: my father speculates that his father was left-handed
12:50:17 PM ThavernesX: now it should be UTF-8
12:50:23 PM pne: try it
12:50:34 PM guitarplayer: interestingly, both my siblings are left-handed, but neither of my parents is
12:50:39 PM pne: γράμματα
12:50:42 PM Fenhl: yeah ok
12:50:47 PM Broca: grammata
12:50:51 PM ThavernesX: how?
12:50:59 PM guitarplayer: there are a few lefties among my great-uncles and -aunts, though, I think
12:51:05 PM pne: ThavernesX: by typing something non-ASCII e.g. nójo again
12:51:17 PM ThavernesX: n?jo
12:51:20 PM Fenhl: no
12:51:37 PM pne: apparently not
12:51:53 PM pne: I see "n"
12:51:57 PM ThavernesX: will restart browser
12:52:00 PM pne: You hunter4ing hunter4!
12:52:02 PM guitarplayer: fwiw, in XChat I see nójo correctly
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12:52:15 PM guitarplayer: and philip's grámmata as well
12:52:29 PM sylviasotomayor: so do I, see the accents and the Greek letters
12:52:30 PM Broca: pne: ach, scheie
12:52:31 PM Fenhl: guitarplayer: XChat does the same auto-correction as Colloquy
12:52:42 PM guitarplayer: oh, ok
12:52:42 PM pne: Broca: was that intentional? I get bad encoding again
12:52:44 PM guitarplayer: didn't know that
12:52:49 PM Fenhl: but Colloquy still shows the [incompatible encoding]
12:52:51 PM Broca: pne: that was intentional
12:52:56 PM pne: oh ok
12:53:10 PM guitarplayer: fen: don't think you can turn that functionality on in xchat, though :\
12:53:11 PM Broca: REPLACEMENT CHARACTER, I think it's called.
12:53:16 PM pne: Broca: did you see Mechthild's T-shirt on Friday?
12:53:22 PM Broca: pne: sure did
12:53:25 PM guitarplayer: yep, "Schei* Unicode"
Thavernes [~Thavernes@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (12:53:26 PM)
12:53:31 PM Fenhl: no
12:53:34 PM Broca: guitarplayer: encoding
12:53:35 PM pne: s/Unicode/Encoding/ IIRC
12:53:40 PM guitarplayer: oh
12:53:43 PM guitarplayer: misremembered
12:53:47 PM Thavernes: All I have to say is n?jo n?jo n?jo
12:53:55 PM Fenhl: no
12:54:02 PM pne: sorry
12:54:32 PM Thavernes: then I will stick to only the base 26 letters ;-(
12:54:50 PM pne: 640K^WASCII should be enough for everybody!
tzirtzi [~tzirtzi@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (12:54:52 PM)
12:55:38 PM sylviasotomayor: pne: hmpf
12:55:52 PM pne: FWIW, one of Mark Rosenfelder's languages does this scale thing, too
12:56:03 PM pne: even with continuous scales - shades of vowel quality will express shades of scale
12:56:12 PM sylviasotomayor: pne: ah. neat.
12:56:17 PM pne: I forget the name right now - the one spoken by ... Elkarîl, that's it
12:56:23 PM Broca: pne: whoa.
12:56:34 PM pne: and they have a hieroglyphical writing system which represents those shades
12:56:46 PM pne: the glyphs are based on faces and you can vary the facial expressions continuously
12:56:46 PM sylviasotomayor: I've been dealing with continuous scale in class lately - and the times when a continuous scale has to be discretized before analysis
12:56:49 PM Broca: Is that the one that is represented by human faces?
12:56:58 PM Broca: Ohh. I remember that one.
12:56:58 PM Thavernes: arbitrarily? My guess is that again the right arm would win out...
12:57:14 PM pne: http://www.zompist.com/elkaril.htm and http://www.zompist.com/elkwrite.htm
12:57:19 PM pne: Broca: exactly
12:57:39 PM Broca: The Zompist should really come to these conferences.
12:57:44 PM guitarplayer: elkaril writing :D
12:57:45 PM pne: indeed
12:58:10 PM Thavernes: how active the Zompist still is?
12:58:14 PM pne: "The colors as well as many oppositional adjectives use the vowel space as a continuous phonetic variable. That is, there is not just one word in between khul `maroon' and khil `red'; the precise degree of redness is indicated by the frontness parameter (or tongue height, between khil and khêl). " etc.
12:58:24 PM sylviasotomayor: lunch!
12:58:56 PM Broca: poltifitsa?
12:59:08 PM Broca: Sorry, forgot the interrogative
12:59:15 PM guitarplayer: gotta leave now :(
12:59:20 PM pne: kumbi? tumbi?
12:59:23 PM Broca: :(
12:59:24 PM pne: something along those lines
12:59:32 PM pne: cidjrpitsa
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Fenhl is now known as Guest999 (1:25:27 PM)
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saizai [~saizai@h-68-164-9-133.chcgilgm.dynamic.covad.net] entered the room. (1:43:13 PM)
1:54:36 PM saizai: lunch break?
1:59:59 PM Dedalvs: We're coming back and about to get started.
2:00:31 PM Broca: Hey! Sai!
2:00:36 PM Broca: Welcome!
Thavernes [~Thavernes@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (2:01:03 PM)
2:01:16 PM Broca: (Can you tell I'm excited about being here?)
2:01:17 PM saizai: good 7am morning :P
2:01:18 PM Thavernes: I'm here again (I think)
2:01:27 PM saizai: *yawns*
2:03:41 PM saizai: btw I'm updating http://bit.ly/lcc4stuff with the videos/pics as they come in
2:04:57 PM Broca: saizai: thanks!
2:05:12 PM saizai: so if anyone other than david has pics pls let me know
2:05:15 PM saizai: I'll insert
cedh [~cedh@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (2:06:27 PM)
2:07:51 PM Broca: Have you noticed how serious everything sounds when it's turned into an eponym?
2:08:30 PM Rejis: what do you mean by eponym?
2:08:39 PM Broca: Named after a person
2:08:52 PM Fenhl: yeah
2:08:54 PM Fenhl: totally
2:08:59 PM Broca: Bohr model. Nash equillibrium, Gnoli triangle ...
2:09:08 PM Dedalvs: Like the Czapp-Johansen hypothesis.
2:09:11 PM sylviasotomayor: Yes.
2:09:16 PM Broca: hirr
2:10:23 PM sylviasotomayor: Oh we will all use it!
2:10:39 PM sylviasotomayor: And cite this conference talk as a source.
2:11:00 PM Dedalvs: And will give it a further level of authenticity by referring to it as the VSH.
2:11:24 PM saizai: VSH?
2:11:32 PM Fenhl: that looks like a sound effect
2:11:40 PM irina: Van Steenbergen Hexagram
2:11:42 PM Fenhl: saizai: Van Steenbergen Hexagon
2:11:45 PM Broca: Oh, I just remembered. Loglan/Lojban has something called Carter vocatives.
2:11:47 PM irina: er, yes
2:11:47 PM saizai: LOL
2:11:52 PM pne: Does anyone else say "Slayvic"? I've always said "Slahvic".
2:12:00 PM irina: I think I say Slavvic.
2:12:03 PM saizai: Dedalvs: I take it that That Guy didn't show?
2:12:09 PM sylviasotomayor: pne: I do Slahvic, too.
2:12:15 PM Rejis: pne: so do I
2:12:17 PM pne: saizai: haven't noticed him
2:12:20 PM Dedalvs: No; no worries.
2:12:21 PM saizai: good
2:12:32 PM saizai: huzzah for peace
2:13:26 PM pne: I heard he had submitted a paper for the conference though
2:14:00 PM Broca: How many papers were submitted?
2:14:01 PM Rejis: who is That Guy?
2:14:11 PM Dedalvs: Not a productive area of discussion.
2:14:44 PM Rejis: okay, I never asked!
2:14:54 PM Dedalvs: :)
2:15:25 PM sylviasotomayor: Whether or not they were conlangers, their saint day is on the conlanger calendar
2:15:37 PM saizai: who's in the pic?
2:15:45 PM Thavernes: Probably Cyril made the language and Method made it methodic?
2:15:50 PM Dedalvs: lol
2:15:51 PM saizai: the stream isn't good enough to make out slides
2:16:00 PM Dedalvs: Then you should download them.
2:16:03 PM Broca: http://conference.conlang.org/lcc4/speakers.php
2:16:40 PM saizai: btw, Dedalvs, can you convert all slides to PDFs and post them to the schedule also?
2:16:44 PM Dedalvs: Can you hear him well enough? He's kind of shying away from the mic.
2:16:52 PM saizai: *has no idea what .tpp is*
2:16:54 PM Dedalvs: I'll let you do that, saizai.
2:16:57 PM Dedalvs: You can e-mail them to me.
2:17:05 PM Dedalvs: I have no idea what .tpp is either.
2:17:13 PM Fenhl: saizai: people keep asking that
2:17:13 PM Broca: saizai: .ppt. Powerpoint. You can open them with OpenOffice.org.
2:17:27 PM Dedalvs: No, not .ppt: .tpp
2:17:28 PM sylviasotomayor: It's a text-only equivalent of ppt. Mechthild used it.
2:17:28 PM Rejis: Dedalvs: formatted text
2:17:28 PM Fenhl: it's some kind of slide markup
2:17:37 PM saizai: *usess openoffice*
2:17:37 PM Broca: Ohh.
2:17:50 PM saizai: ask her for a pdf?
2:17:51 PM Broca: I assumed it was an ad-hoc bash script :-D
2:17:51 PM Rejis: you can open it in $editor
2:18:31 PM Rejis: Broca: tpp is written in ruby
2:19:36 PM saizai: btw, more pics
2:19:49 PM saizai: hm, might be able to convert it
2:19:51 PM saizai: *attemps*
2:20:14 PM Rejis: saizai: converting tpp is not that difficult
Amanda [~androirc@167-4.nyc.dsl.access.net] entered the room. (2:20:36 PM)
2:20:38 PM saizai: Rejis: using what?
2:20:44 PM Dedalvs: Hey Amanda!
2:20:59 PM Amanda: hi!
2:21:11 PM sylviasotomayor: hi!
2:21:13 PM Rejis: I guess just using tpp and copy and pasting the text into a txt document
kaleissin [~taliesin@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (2:21:16 PM)
2:21:34 PM Rejis: actually...
2:21:42 PM Rejis: I can export it into tex...
2:22:11 PM Amanda: not on the good computer yet so all I can do is irc :-) 
2:22:30 PM saizai: tex -> pdf is easy
2:22:50 PM saizai: *is still waking up*
2:22:53 PM saizai: damn time lag
2:23:12 PM Dedalvs: http://steen.free.fr/slovianski/constructed_slavic_languages.html
2:24:15 PM Broca: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dachsprache#Dachsprache
2:24:24 PM pne: Dedalvs: thanks
2:24:57 PM Rejis: errr no
2:25:04 PM Rejis: the -l tag does not work
2:25:25 PM saizai: btw please do continue to break the stream at each talk
2:25:32 PM saizai: makes it easier to notate
2:25:44 PM saizai: and update the first versions to YT
2:26:01 PM Dedalvs: We've been having a lot of problems with Ustream recording.
2:26:14 PM Dedalvs: Have you been able even to get the talks from today...?
2:26:18 PM Dedalvs: It keeps crashing.
2:26:27 PM Dedalvs: I didn't know if the talks had been lost...
2:26:44 PM saizai: yes
2:26:53 PM saizai: well, I didn't watch through each
2:26:58 PM Dedalvs: Which part are you saying "yes" to?
2:27:10 PM saizai: just beginning and end to see who's in it so I can label it in http://bit.ly/lcc4stuff
2:27:24 PM saizai: yes, they seem to've been recorded OK
2:27:27 PM saizai: mostly
2:28:08 PM Dedalvs: Thank goodness.
2:28:18 PM Dedalvs: We haven't been able to save/label a lot of them properly today.
2:28:20 PM Amanda: yay
2:28:31 PM Dedalvs: Or at least from our end. Glad they're saving!
2:28:33 PM saizai: I'm labelling them in ustream
2:28:50 PM saizai: and i'm going to see about using its clip-and-upload-to-yt feature
2:28:54 PM Broca: Dedalvs: wow, you're fast at uploading pics.
2:29:05 PM saizai: also my bandwidth sucks :(
2:29:20 PM Dedalvs: I just put them on Twitter; saizai's uploading them. :)
2:29:22 PM saizai: I can't download the ppts
2:29:35 PM saizai: or put them somewhere and post me a link
2:29:48 PM saizai: or send them to Dedalvs to upload to the lcc server
2:29:54 PM saizai: or post them to pics.conlang.org
2:30:06 PM saizai: I can't handle files per se, I'm just manipulating tagging
2:30:17 PM saizai: (viz. bandwidth issues from my shitty dsl)
2:30:22 PM Dedalvs: Is Jan out of frame?
2:30:30 PM Dedalvs: Right now?
2:30:35 PM Broca: Dedalvs: no
2:30:40 PM Dedalvs: Thanks.
2:30:51 PM saizai: no, but he's now saying "it's a possibility and it tends to be …"
2:30:54 PM Broca: I _think_ it's the ustream computer I'm looking at.
2:31:01 PM saizai: "one option is reconstructed proto…"
2:31:09 PM Broca: Backwards-facing laptop is ustream, left-facing laptop is archival?
2:31:14 PM saizai: what's the delay?
2:31:22 PM Dedalvs: Just want to make sure he's in frame when he's on the right side of the screen, and when he's at the podium.
2:31:30 PM Dedalvs: Long delay. 5 sec
2:31:31 PM Dedalvs: ?
2:31:37 PM sylviasotomayor: Broca: yes
2:31:47 PM Fenhl: 2.5 for me
2:33:31 PM saizai: 5s is not so bad at all
2:34:02 PM saizai: in frame is from the speaker on the R of the screen to the podium
2:34:13 PM Dedalvs: Got ya. Thanks.
2:34:14 PM saizai: so right now he's about .5' within frame IRL
2:34:42 PM saizai: when he leans back he's just within frame
2:34:43 PM Broca: Half a foot?
2:35:23 PM saizai: yes
2:35:25 PM saizai: now he's out of frame
2:35:40 PM saizai: well, his hand and shirt ar
2:35:46 PM saizai: better
2:35:55 PM Dedalvs: lol
2:35:58 PM Dedalvs: Stop walking so far away!
2:36:00 PM Fenhl: lol
2:36:07 PM saizai: but the quality isn't so great that it matters
2:36:21 PM saizai: it's mostly just audio + gist of video :P
2:42:03 PM saizai: I wonder if he'll address the whole 'slovio' issue
2:42:24 PM pne: "the whole" issue? Wouldn't that take days?
2:42:26 PM Dedalvs: I believe he just did.
2:42:33 PM pne: Dedalvs: that, too.
2:42:57 PM pne: well, not "the issue" as such, but mentioned it as an example and where it fits in the categorisation
2:43:09 PM Broca: How much time does he have?
2:43:12 PM saizai: well, mentioning some of the issue?
2:43:14 PM saizai: iunno.
2:43:16 PM saizai: *shrugs*
2:43:20 PM Broca: I'm afraid kaleissin and I have to leave at 15:30
2:43:20 PM saizai: so far this seems good
2:43:30 PM Fenhl: both would make most sense imo
2:43:41 PM Fenhl: re: latin/cyrillic
2:44:47 PM pne: Fenhl: Slovianski uses both
2:44:55 PM pne: or perhaps "either" would be a better word
2:44:57 PM saizai: is don around?
2:45:06 PM pne: there are standard orthographies for both alphabets and you can choose whichever you like
2:45:08 PM Dedalvs: He's not on here.
2:45:13 PM saizai: m
2:45:41 PM saizai: nice how they all have flags :P
2:46:37 PM saizai: sylviasotomayor: do you know the @fiatlingua twitter p/w?
2:47:04 PM sylviasotomayor: saizai: no, sorry.
2:47:09 PM saizai: ok
2:47:11 PM saizai: don it is then
2:47:20 PM Fenhl: who is managing that account?
2:47:22 PM Fenhl: don?
2:47:24 PM saizai: yeah
2:47:32 PM saizai: I want to connect it to the ustream acct
DonBoozer [~DonBoozer@h60.173.29.71.dynamic.ip.windstream.net] entered the room. (2:47:36 PM)
2:47:36 PM saizai: but I don't know the pw :P
2:47:37 PM sylviasotomayor: Fenhl: don is Don Boozer.
2:47:41 PM saizai: tadaaa
2:47:44 PM Dedalvs: Oh!
2:47:46 PM Dedalvs: Don is here!
Jenny [~Jenny@c83-252-173-49.bredband.comhem.se] entered the room. (2:47:51 PM)
2:47:55 PM Broca: saizai: how did you do that?
2:47:55 PM saizai: *asks him*
2:47:59 PM Dedalvs: Jenny!
2:48:03 PM saizai: *has no idea*
2:48:05 PM Jenny: Hi :)
2:48:05 PM DonBoozer: Hi!
2:48:08 PM saizai: speak of the devil?
2:48:19 PM DonBoozer: :-)
2:48:23 PM saizai: 'cept that Don is the nicest person I've ever met, so
2:48:23 PM Fenhl: saizai can summon people O.o
2:48:37 PM DonBoozer: aw shucks... please.. don't ... stop.
2:48:37 PM Broca: saizai: no-one here communicated with him out-of-band? Yes, that's freaky.
2:48:54 PM saizai: nope
2:49:03 PM saizai: *grins*
2:49:08 PM DonBoozer: Had my name come up previously?
2:49:18 PM saizai: yes
2:49:21 PM saizai: did you get my pm?
2:49:23 PM sylviasotomayor: DonBoozer: just 2 lines before
2:49:27 PM kaleissin: Lykara will be wanting to talk with you no doubt
2:49:30 PM saizai: it's probably in another tab
2:49:33 PM DonBoozer: Nope, just thought it was time to login.
2:49:41 PM saizai: good timing then
2:49:46 PM pne: kaleissin: does she know that?
2:50:04 PM kaleissin: I said to her that Don was the man, yeah
2:50:15 PM DonBoozer: :-) I started tweeting again and retweeted Dedalvs's yfrog photos.
2:50:21 PM pne: kaleissin: ah good, ok
2:50:22 PM DonBoozer: from @FiatLingua.
2:50:32 PM saizai: DonBoozer: post http://bit.ly/lcc4stuff once you take a look at it
2:50:38 PM saizai: I'm maintaining it
2:50:47 PM saizai: has all photo, video, transcripts
Amanda left the room (quit: Ping timeout: 480 seconds). (2:50:55 PM)
2:51:03 PM saizai: btw make a bit.ly account and I'll give you access
2:51:17 PM saizai: (same for the other org people)
2:53:49 PM saizai: what time is it there?
2:53:55 PM Broca: 14:53
2:53:56 PM Fenhl: 14:53
2:53:58 PM Dedalvs: 2:53 p.m.
2:54:29 PM saizai: thx
2:54:35 PM Fenhl: lol, ninjas
2:55:04 PM saizai: DonBoozer: please look at your other tab in which I /msg'd you
2:55:12 PM saizai: or type /msg saizai foo to see it
2:55:33 PM saizai: or get on IM :P
2:57:27 PM Fenhl: questions?
2:58:09 PM saizai: Dedalvs: if there's extra time, have him address the Issue
DonBoozer left the room (quit: Ping timeout: 480 seconds). (2:58:26 PM)
3:01:10 PM saizai: (if)
3:01:10 PM Fenhl: saizai: looks like there is no extra time
3:01:15 PM saizai: 'sok
Broca left the room (quit: Quit: leaving). (3:01:26 PM)
3:01:30 PM saizai: cut the ustream?
3:04:10 PM saizai: next is Johan Derks?
kaleissin left the room (quit: Quit: Homeward bound, seeya!). (3:06:07 PM)
abf [~abf@167-4.nyc.dsl.access.net] entered the room. (3:06:18 PM)
3:06:23 PM pne: saizai: right
3:06:26 PM abf: Amanda again!
3:06:31 PM saizai: good
3:06:36 PM abf: Now I'm on the real computer
3:06:49 PM saizai: also y'all should get someone to record the afterparty games
3:06:54 PM pne: games?
3:07:12 PM saizai: Dedalvs tweeted yesterday something about kaleissin's IPA game?
3:07:19 PM saizai: but I have no idea what it is
3:07:27 PM saizai: and photo < video
3:07:30 PM saizai: but get more photos :P
3:07:48 PM Fenhl: that was yesterday, I doubt that there will be another game today
3:08:18 PM Fenhl: mainly because kaleissin is going
3:10:30 PM saizai: also, Dedalvs: if Mert presented he should have a thing on the speakers page
3:10:44 PM saizai: Fenhl: there can always be another game?
3:10:56 PM saizai: or other afterparty stuff worth sharing
3:11:00 PM abf: are they taking a break?
3:12:43 PM pne: saizai: oh right, she had brought cards
3:12:56 PM pne: did they play that last night?
3:13:10 PM pne: presumably, since she just left
3:13:11 PM pne: we're starting now
3:13:22 PM pne: is the stream on?
3:13:35 PM saizai: yes
3:14:19 PM pne: pity, I would have liked to participate in the IPA game
3:17:23 PM saizai: Dedalvs: don't forget to get johan's slides
3:17:36 PM saizai: and chrys'
3:17:50 PM Dedalvs: Chrys had no slides.
3:17:59 PM saizai: k
3:18:01 PM Dedalvs: Also, you don't need to remind me to do things.
3:18:17 PM saizai: then you're better than me :P
3:18:18 PM Thavernes: we have to scan the pages of chrys in and upload these
3:18:28 PM Thavernes: (or he has to)
3:18:30 PM Dedalvs: That would be nice.
3:18:34 PM Dedalvs: I'll have to do that when I get home.
3:18:37 PM saizai: pages?
3:18:41 PM Dedalvs: Handout.
3:18:44 PM saizai: cool
3:18:45 PM sylviasotomayor: saizai: handouts
3:18:51 PM saizai: any others?
3:18:59 PM Dedalvs: I've got a scanner at home, so I'll take care of it.
3:19:01 PM saizai: better, ask chrys for the original file
3:19:08 PM saizai: and convert to pdf
3:19:12 PM Dedalvs: lol
3:19:13 PM sylviasotomayor: saizai: they are hand drawn
3:19:16 PM saizai: oh
3:19:20 PM saizai: n/m then :P
3:19:37 PM Thavernes: some are typed, so he should have originals
3:19:43 PM pne: saizai:3/5 are computer-output text though, but 2/5 are hand-drawn
3:19:49 PM Dedalvs: Ah, true.
3:19:51 PM saizai: *nods*
3:19:57 PM sylviasotomayor: pne: yes, true
3:20:11 PM Dedalvs: By the way, is he in frame?
3:20:12 PM saizai: combine the two? better quality if you get digital originals
3:20:17 PM saizai: yup
3:20:23 PM pne: yup
3:20:26 PM Dedalvs: And can you hear him?
3:20:31 PM Dedalvs: He's a bit away from the mic.
3:20:31 PM saizai: he's well to thre right of the podium and the full podium is in frame
3:20:35 PM saizai: yeah, sound is ok
3:20:55 PM saizai: only difficulty for me is understanding the accent / cadence
3:21:27 PM saizai: and that I can only barely make out the shapes on the slides
3:21:53 PM pne: his "slides" appear to be simply individual images which he is showing in succession in an image viewer
3:22:02 PM Thavernes: yes, 'borrowing sounds like 'burrowing' 
3:22:16 PM saizai: yes
3:22:22 PM Thavernes: but that's the best we Dutch apparantly can do
3:22:29 PM pne: oy
3:22:32 PM saizai: 's what he told me, hence my "convert to pdf" :P
3:22:45 PM pne: Jan van Steenbergen had slides!
3:23:01 PM saizai: eh, this is easy to fix before posting
3:23:05 PM saizai: no need to worry about it
3:31:47 PM Dedalvs: "cashew"?
3:31:59 PM tzirtzi: and indeed dinky-toy
3:32:13 PM sylviasotomayor: It is a very important word, dinky-toy
3:32:19 PM tzirtzi: crucial
3:32:26 PM sylviasotomayor: I use it all the time.
3:32:27 PM pne: what about slinky?
3:32:33 PM sylviasotomayor: Also very important
3:32:34 PM Dedalvs: That's a type of dinky-toy.
3:32:36 PM pne: It gave rise to the Lojban term of art "slinku'i", after all
3:33:17 PM pne: (Which was proposed as a loanword for "slinky" but was abandoned because it doesn't self-segregate always. In other words, it fails what is now called "the slinku'i test".)
3:33:28 PM Dedalvs: LOL
3:33:33 PM Dedalvs: I love it!
3:33:46 PM Dedalvs: This one's small even for us here.
3:34:15 PM sylviasotomayor: I hope we get a copy that we can zoom in on.
3:34:21 PM Dedalvs: We will.
3:34:33 PM sylviasotomayor: Good
3:35:24 PM Dedalvs: This is actually a neat table.
3:35:33 PM sylviasotomayor: Yes, I agree.
3:35:38 PM Dedalvs: I'll see if I can get these before he turns his computer off.
3:35:42 PM tzirtzi: very much indeed, im looking forward to seeing a more legible version
3:35:50 PM Dedalvs: Actually, can I borrow someone's memory stick?
3:35:55 PM saizai: I tried to convert Mechthild's .tpp to .tex, but my latex compiler barfed on it :(
3:35:57 PM sylviasotomayor: I have one.
3:35:59 PM Dedalvs: I'll just grab them off his computer and transfer them.
3:36:24 PM pne: Dedalvs: do you want it now?
3:36:36 PM pne: ah ok
3:36:38 PM Dedalvs: Got it.
3:38:55 PM pne: "The Germanic language group also comprises Japanese, Maltese, and Swahili"
3:38:59 PM pne: :)
3:39:04 PM Dedalvs: Heh, heh...
3:39:15 PM Dedalvs: This is neat, though, because the grouping is based on internal comformity.
3:39:17 PM tzirtzi: well, japanese and germanic are very similar really...
3:39:20 PM sylviasotomayor: It's an interesting analysis given his criteria
3:39:29 PM tzirtzi: they're both OV... and... um...
3:39:31 PM Dedalvs: So it's kind of like Vonnegut's idea of a karass.
3:39:39 PM Dedalvs: Anyone read Cat's Cradle?
3:39:41 PM sylviasotomayor: Yes, a linguistic karass
3:39:45 PM Dedalvs: Yeah!
3:39:59 PM pne: Also, the grouping "Islamic-like language group" needs to be used more
3:40:03 PM Dedalvs: Related to how readily they borrow words from English. :)
3:40:30 PM sylviasotomayor: Yes, and I expect the groups would be different for measures based on other languages
3:40:39 PM pne: most likely
3:40:41 PM Dedalvs: Oooh...
3:40:47 PM sylviasotomayor: like ease of borrowing from Spanish or French or Chinese
3:40:48 PM Dedalvs: I want all these statistics.
3:40:50 PM pne: but English is probably one of the best to use as a source
3:40:53 PM pne: I imagine?
3:40:56 PM Rejis: Dedalvs: what is karass?
3:41:06 PM Dedalvs: It's a group of people bound by fate.
3:41:10 PM pne: due to the influence internationally
3:41:13 PM Rejis: oh
3:41:17 PM pne: Dedalvs: thanks
3:41:47 PM sylviasotomayor: re karass, see also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cat's_Cradle
Thavernes98 [~Thavernes@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (3:42:03 PM)
3:42:25 PM Thavernes98: s
Thavernes left the room (quit: Ping timeout: 480 seconds). (3:42:38 PM)
3:43:23 PM saizai: hm, looks like removing the umlaut package fixed it.
3:44:17 PM pne: I wonder whether we can get the transcript of his talk (i.e. the pages he's reading from)
3:44:34 PM Dedalvs: I think he plans to submit it as a paper.
3:44:44 PM Dedalvs: I'm *not* certain he's done with it, though.
3:44:55 PM pne: hm
3:45:01 PM pne: could we get the draft?
3:45:06 PM Dedalvs: I'll ask.
3:45:08 PM pne: or do you think he'd prefer to wait until it's done?
3:45:09 PM pne: thanks!
3:46:44 PM sylviasotomayor: That is maybe a better count of speakers - students taken college level classes in the language
3:46:48 PM sylviasotomayor: Maybe.
3:46:51 PM pne: more people study through Basque than through Finnish?
3:47:00 PM Dedalvs: What?!
3:47:03 PM Dedalvs: You're right!
3:47:07 PM Dedalvs: That can't be right.
3:47:15 PM sylviasotomayor: Yeah, that sounds suspect.
3:47:31 PM Dedalvs: There are only 650,000 Basque speakers.
3:47:35 PM pne: Those numbers must be something else than "study courses given in that language"
3:47:41 PM Rejis: saizai: I converted it to pdf
3:47:44 PM sylviasotomayor: Unless I misunderstood and he's counting high school
3:47:51 PM sylviasotomayor: or elementary school
3:47:58 PM saizai: Rejis: cool, give to Dedalvs for uploading?
3:48:09 PM pne: he said he couldn't get those statistics from unesco, though....
3:48:17 PM sylviasotomayor: Either that or Finnish colleges conduct classes in English or another language.
3:48:23 PM tzirtzi: my understand of what he said was that its no of students enrolled in courses taught in those languages at 3rd (ie university) level over a period of time unspecified
3:48:26 PM pne: sylviasotomayor: that's certainly possible too
3:48:28 PM tzirtzi: *understandin
3:48:31 PM tzirtzi: *g
3:48:38 PM pne: ah, the period of time could play a role
Thavernes98 left the room (quit: Quit: Thavernes98). (3:48:40 PM)
3:48:40 PM sylviasotomayor: Though it seems odd to teach college level classes in Basque
3:48:43 PM sylviasotomayor: but cool!
3:49:10 PM pne: when I looked up briefly, the last entry on the list (Slovenian) looked like "Sumerian" to me!
3:49:21 PM pne: pattern recognition failure ;-)
3:49:29 PM Rejis: hehehe
3:49:33 PM sylviasotomayor: That would be another good language to study Physics in.
3:49:44 PM Rejis: Sumerian surely does not loan many words
3:49:50 PM sylviasotomayor: :-)
3:49:55 PM pne: heh
3:50:14 PM saizai: heh, pity
3:50:21 PM pne: On the other hand, if people did a Cornish on Sumerian, I'd imagine it'd have to
3:50:29 PM saizai: you're missing out on all those native Sumerian speakers
3:51:39 PM pne: interesting graph
3:51:51 PM pne: especially the conclusion
3:51:52 PM sylviasotomayor: pne: yes
3:52:17 PM sylviasotomayor: orangerie in English
3:52:29 PM sylviasotomayor: greenhouse for oranges
3:52:49 PM sylviasotomayor: as far as I know, the only word anywhere for that sort of thing
3:52:59 PM Fenhl: technical term -> not valid esperanto
3:53:04 PM Dedalvs: Where I'm from, it was "orange grove".
3:53:19 PM Dedalvs: I thought "reciti" was a pretty good term.
3:53:38 PM Fenhl: yeah, most of them are good
3:53:40 PM sylviasotomayor: except, from context I get the idea that an orangerie was specifically indoors like a greenhouse and not an orchard or grove
3:53:44 PM pne: What's a "vertrago"? A contract?
3:53:49 PM Fenhl: yeah
3:53:56 PM Fenhl: probably
3:53:58 PM pne: ouch. That's not an international form
3:54:14 PM abf: Can anybody say about when the relay presentation will be beginning?
3:54:22 PM sylviasotomayor: soon
3:54:27 PM abf: Ok thanks
3:54:34 PM pne: abf: It's the next item on the agenda...
3:54:50 PM abf: Yeah, I hadn't heard him conclude till right after I asked :)
3:54:57 PM pne: ok
3:55:04 PM Fenhl: lol
3:55:19 PM sylviasotomayor: OK, the last word on orangerie: http://www.kent-conservatory.co.uk/orangeries.htm
3:55:40 PM Fenhl: with that logic, less known dog races are not valid words
3:56:04 PM pne: sylviasotomayor: thanks!
3:56:34 PM pne: does anyone want to be online via skype for the relay?
3:56:50 PM sylviasotomayor: pne: you're welcome.
3:56:54 PM saizai: cut the ustream again at some point nowish
3:57:07 PM sylviasotomayor: saizai: yes, yes, getting to it.
3:57:11 PM saizai: :P
3:58:48 PM saizai: and added to the list
3:58:56 PM saizai: whee.
Andrej [~Andrej@212.235.178.210] entered the room. (4:03:08 PM)
4:03:24 PM sylviasotomayor: Andrej: Hello
4:03:35 PM sylviasotomayor: We are doing the relay here in a few minutes.
4:03:51 PM sylviasotomayor: Did you want to get on skype to recite your part when the time comes?
4:04:03 PM sylviasotomayor: (I am assuming you are the right Andrej)
4:04:06 PM Andrej: Hey, yeah, I just managed to get my internet working and I'm watching the video
4:04:24 PM Andrej: I've jsut sent to David a recording of my text
4:04:35 PM saizai: … that's a long relay list
4:04:44 PM sylviasotomayor: Andrej: Thanks!
4:05:21 PM Andrej: Skype is lagging a bit for me ...
4:05:24 PM irina: sylviasotomayor: in Dutch too, "oranjerie"
4:06:01 PM sylviasotomayor: irina: thanks
4:06:13 PM Jenny: So what's going on now?
4:06:13 PM irina: Andrej: you're the person who got the torch from me, right?
4:06:21 PM Andrej: and by the way, my surname 0160uc is pronounced as /Suts/ 
4:06:28 PM Andrej: Irina, yeah
4:06:58 PM Andrej: the scheduleless relay
4:09:01 PM saizai: Andrej: "0160uc"?
4:09:10 PM pne: \u0160uc
4:09:14 PM saizai: o
4:09:21 PM irina: S-caron?
4:09:38 PM irina: pronounced [S] afaik
4:09:58 PM irina: sylviasotomayor: an oranjerie is specifically a place to put your tropical plants in winter
4:10:23 PM irina: sylviasotomayor: if you have a stately home
4:10:35 PM sylviasotomayor: irina: yes. enclosed is more important than oranges
4:10:44 PM sylviasotomayor: to the definition
Thavernes [~Thavernes@92.67.177.153] entered the room. (4:10:45 PM)
4:15:34 PM Jenny: Can someone send the link to the page on the screen?
4:16:05 PM sylviasotomayor: Try http://dedalvs.com/relay/previous/lcc4participants.html
Amanda [~androirc@167-4.nyc.dsl.access.net] entered the room. (4:16:53 PM)
4:18:18 PM sylviasotomayor: and then the pattern: http://dedalvs.com/relay/results/1.html and 2.html and 3.html, etc
4:18:57 PM Jenny: Thanks!
4:19:41 PM sylviasotomayor: irina: and the stateliness. yes.
4:19:57 PM irina: hey, the relay text was the same in the scheduled and unscheduled relay
4:20:34 PM irina: I remember that story!
4:21:09 PM Andrej: yeah, it was the same but i think the schedule-less relay had smaller changes of the text
4:21:25 PM irina: fewer people in it?
4:21:50 PM irina: I think I was only the second, I got it from Arthaey and she got it from David
4:22:09 PM irina: so you were third
4:22:13 PM Andrej: ah, that could be the reason then
4:22:18 PM irina: several people dropped out before me
4:23:58 PM Andrej: right
4:24:09 PM Andrej: how many participants were there in total?
4:24:56 PM irina: I should check on frathwiki but my firefox is acting up
4:25:12 PM Andrej: ok
4:29:02 PM irina: 10 in the as yet unfinished scheduleless ring (people who actually did it)
4:29:34 PM irina: 16 in the main ring, counting david only once
4:30:04 PM irina: firefox doesn't like livestream and chokes on it every now and again
4:30:16 PM saizai: it's working for me in chrome
4:30:28 PM irina: probably my &%#@ new install
4:30:44 PM irina: I wish I'd never upgrade
4:30:45 PM irina: d
4:30:59 PM irina: there's chrome for linux, right? I might try that
4:31:18 PM irina: opera is more forgiving but I don't like its interface
4:31:54 PM saizai: no rI
4:32:08 PM saizai: it might be a flash issue?
4:32:13 PM irina: yes, probably
4:32:19 PM saizai: linux + flash have never been best of friends
4:32:40 PM irina: or just a friefox issue because I've heard other complaints about ff4 (all platforms)
4:34:32 PM saizai: m
4:37:57 PM saizai: another way: copy paste it into notepad
4:38:04 PM saizai: and change the font there
4:38:45 PM saizai: some people w/ types of dyslexia have issues w/ serif fonts, I've seen others who have this problem
4:41:35 PM saizai: hm, is Christophe here?
4:42:07 PM irina: not in the channel unless he uses a nickname I've never heard of)
4:42:22 PM irina: er, insert an opening parenthesis somewhere sensible
4:42:28 PM saizai: n
4:45:58 PM saizai: what's the total attendance IRL?
4:50:12 PM sylviasotomayor: ~23
4:53:18 PM saizai: m. some were missing from the group shot?
4:53:25 PM saizai: that was 17 iirc
4:53:40 PM sylviasotomayor: 23 was yesyerday then
4:53:54 PM saizai: group shot was yesterday eve :P
4:54:01 PM saizai: from david's tweet
4:54:19 PM saizai: http://bit.ly/k2fLUK?r=bb
4:54:23 PM sylviasotomayor: oh, that was not the full group
4:54:32 PM saizai: *nod*
4:55:00 PM Andrej: i really wish i was there now :( especially because it's in europe and relatively close to me
4:57:07 PM pne: Double entendre much?
4:57:29 PM pne: "Was it good for you"?
4:57:37 PM saizai: indeed
4:57:49 PM saizai: is that present in the Treoygeum?
5:07:23 PM Andrej: xD
Jenny left the room (quit: Quit: Jenny). (5:17:30 PM)
Jenny [~Jenny@c83-252-173-49.bredband.comhem.se] entered the room. (5:18:10 PM)
5:24:20 PM pne: About the only things that remain are the river and the concept of marrying
5:25:01 PM Amanda: Wow, this was quite the relay!
5:25:15 PM pne: I'll say!
5:25:29 PM saizai: m
5:28:36 PM Thavernes: bye! And thanks!
5:28:39 PM Rejis: yeah, pne 
Thavernes left the room (quit: Quit: Thavernes). (5:28:40 PM)
5:28:44 PM saizai: *claps*
5:30:28 PM pne: so LCC will become like YAPC
5:30:38 PM Amanda: bye all...
5:30:44 PM saizai: YAPC
5:30:45 PM pne: (or YAPC::Europe, at least - I don't know about YAPC::NA)
5:30:46 PM pne: bye Amanda!
Amanda left the room (quit: Quit: AndroIRC). (5:30:48 PM)
5:30:48 PM saizai: ?
5:30:59 PM pne: Yet Another Perl Conference - http://www.yapceurope.org/ I think
5:31:04 PM saizai: ah
5:31:30 PM pne: the grass-roots answer to O'Reilly big Perl Conference (now Open Source Conference/OSCON)
abf left the room (quit: Quit: Leaving). (5:31:33 PM)
5:31:38 PM saizai: *nod*
5:31:44 PM saizai: one can hope.
5:32:07 PM saizai: whee sylvia
5:32:38 PM pne: and christophe, and thea!
5:32:53 PM saizai: *wants some of that food :P*
Rejis left the room (quit: Quit: Only the German national team can turn a 2:2 into a 4:1.). (5:33:09 PM)
5:33:11 PM sylviasotomayor: ok, gotta shut down. bye!
sylviasotomayor left the room (quit: Quit: Leaving). (5:33:15 PM)
5:33:20 PM saizai: *waves*
5:33:57 PM Fenhl: bye
Fenhl left the room (quit: Quit: Client exit, pursued by a bear.). (5:33:59 PM)
pne left the room (quit: Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client). (5:37:44 PM)
5:38:38 PM Andrej: hmm ... next conference hosted in Slovenia? ;)
5:38:54 PM saizai: do you have a proposal? :P
5:39:30 PM Dedalvs: I'm grabbing the IRC chat log now.
5:39:38 PM Dedalvs: So if you have something you want included, better type it RIGHT now!
5:39:43 PM Jenny: D:
5:39:47 PM Dedalvs: lol
5:39:50 PM ingsve: Me Orzo!
5:39:50 PM saizai: W00 LCC
5:39:54 PM Jenny: Indeed
5:39:55 PM Jenny: WOO
5:39:59 PM Andrej: great conference!
5:40:07 PM Jenny: Wish I had been there
5:40:13 PM saizai: ditto
5:40:24 PM Dedalvs: @ingsve: lol!